Tuesday, 20 October 2009

'Britain needs an Islamic revolution' - Really?

Extremism breeds exterminism?

Anjem Choudary and Islam4UK really scare me - I find their obsession with the removal and suppression of all that defines freedom; positive and negative alike - genuinely terrifying.

Can I report them for inciting terrorism?

I would willingly take up arms against atavistic religious fundamentalism and see my sons do likewise to defend freedom of expression - but I accept that is a gut response, born of fear and perhaps a lack of understanding.

Of course I should be tolerant - I have been told so by the righteous; the Quilliam Foundation tell me that Anjem Choudary does not speak for all Muslims, when discussing my concerns the response is often "Clara you sound like a racist and a bigot" - a criticism that genuinely distresses me.

That said I do know that there were Jewish leaders, ignored by the international community, in 1930s Germany, warning of the rise of the National Socialists - Churchill himself identified the Nazis as a threat and was roundly set upon by those around him, accused of being a scaremonger and corrosive naysayer.

Naysayers are painted as intolerant of free speech and unnecessarily pessimistic - and for good reason. The right to freedom of expression is sacrosanct, and we should not criticise others - that's right innit? Therein lies a conundrum, one that the vacillation over Geert Wilder's UK admission is a good example of.

There is a walk in Westminster being planned for the 5th of November, and if my recent illness and lack of self-employed income had not taken it's toll I had planned to be there, this walk in the sunshine a symbolic gesture "in the den of thieves", as OH would have it - a poignant symbol of our displeasure with those who sit in the Palace nearby and an all too rare act of public solidarity in these troubled times.

My knee jerk reaction to Anjem Choudary's proclamation in the video? Fuck freedom of expression, forget a symbolic walk in the sun to celebrate a failed 17th century plot against our own parliament, Islam4UK are plotting against our freedom - now. The 5th of November's vague relevance to our current situation will be lost on the mass of the British sheeple - and we know how unlikely a walk on that day is to change anything. There is a clear and present danger we cannot ignore, I quote

"Islam4UK would like to declare the launch of a spectacular procession that will take place on 31st October 2009"

"We hereby request all Muslims in the United Kingdom, in Manchester, Leeds, Cardiff, Glasgow and all other places to join us and collectively declare that as submitters to Almighty Allah (SWT), we have had enough of democracy and man-made law and the depravity of the British culture. On this day we will call for a complete upheaval of the British ruling system its members and legislature, and demand the full implementation of Shari'ah in Britain."

This constitutes a declaration of war - the walk in the sunshine on the 5th of November? Merely rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic.

What about the 31st of October, toe to toe with Islam4UK in a silent protest? I'll crawl to London from Edinburgh for that...

Sorry OH


  1. "What about the 31st of October, toe to toe with Islam4UK? I'll crawl to London from Edinburgh for that..."

    Me anaw. Islam is a clear and present danger that must be crushed ( is that too harsh? Nah.). When an ideology clearly enunciates its evil intentions for our future I take it seriously. Don't listen to the weak kneed apologists - get organized.

  2. Do you know scunnert, I actually felt guilty about this post, and still do. It cuts me to the quick to think that I am some kind of paranoid anti-free-speech racist conspiracy theorist - but I guess that's just my liberal conditioning. These fundamentalists are a threat, particularly to women but essentially to all we value; the prospect of a Sharia Islam UK genuinely terrifies me.

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  4. To be fair to OH he did plan his march first :)

    I I'm not sure if what islam4uk are saying counts as terrorism or not but from looking at the relevant laws (as far as I could find them) it does seem to be a very clear cut case of treason. I think how the police handle it will be very very informative. (Sadly unavoidable out of London that day)

    Just to add a further data point I to tend to get the same sort of accusations of racism and being a right wing mail reader when ever I suggest that Islam isn't at heart the nicest of religions and is a bit of a problem.

  5. Thanks for your comment Giolla, I am very much a Lefty Liberal Libertarian (who loves alliteration apparently), I tend to agree the problem is not the outsiders politics but the medieval dogma espoused by Islamic extremists and amply demonstrated by states such as the Saudis.

    I am of course not advocating a boycott of OH's walk - it's a splendid idea, and as I said one I wish I could join - but I see the Islam4UK march as a much more immediate problem, and have yet to hear of any opposition to it, despite its very threatening overtones.

  6. Polaris,

    Shouldn't that be "Who adores alliteration apparently"?

    Criticising the dogma and techniques without being taken as criticising anything else does seem to be problematic. The alternative I get to the racism accusation is normally "well the Christians have been just as bad" or similar.

    I wasn't suggesting that you were advocating any sort of boycott (is it safe to say that word?) of OH's walk. Was more meant to be a comment on how comparatively late in the day this procession seems to have to light. I'm still not sure if it won't do more good in the long term if this march goes ahead un-opposed with lots of media coverage. I think if there's any trouble it'll be presented as trouble being caused by those opposing the marchers. From a waking people up point of view I hope for a large march that kicks off trouble on it's own.

    Though OH has said he intends to be there selling beer.

  7. Grammer n stuff - I just can't get the hang of it!

    The whole racist/bigot problem is a real toughie, come across too strong and you are a prejudiced commentator and written off - surely we can discuss sensitive subjects without ducking as the brickbats are thrown our way for being honest about how we feel? I am willing to be shown the error of my ways, convince me, engage me - I like learning...

    You are probably correct - media coverage may be sufficient to show the marchers in an unfavourable light, but negative reaction is often quickly written off as the fault of biased media. Ignoring this march doesn't make it disappear, in fact a lack of opposition may even convince the Islam4UK nutjobs of the veracity of their beliefs.

    OH is a scream, I hope he didn't buy too much Carling...

  8. " we have had enough of democracy and man-made law and the depravity of the British culture. " I think we know the answer to that problem Mr. Choudary. If you don't like it, Foxtrot Oscar.

    I am not a bigot but I know my history; Islam undoubtedly spread by war and conquest, Europe eventually saw them off militarily ( thanks to the Mongols ) before our technology left them behind. That did not stop them expanding eastward and they would have taken over all of India had it not been for the intervention of the East India Company.

    Back to the present day; a moderate Muslim might be satisfied with a single Caliphate of Islamic lands but that would have to include any lands that Had previously been Muslim ( Spain, most of the Balkans and much of Italy ) or that Now have large Muslim communities, like Luton or Bradford which is why they like to congregrate in some towns and not others.
    If they want to pay the 'historical revisionist' card it is time we asked for Constantinople back and Alexandria for that matter.

  9. I think Leg-Iron probably has the best take on the racist/bigot problem, at least the only one which I can see as being at all viable. Ask the accuser to explain why what you've said is racist, and then hen they can't carry on explaining your view point. Honesty and strong feeling do seem to be strongly discouraged though except in approved of circumstances.

    The EDL's response to the islam4UK march is rather well thought out and explained. I think it highlights partly why any counter demonstration could be problematic at this time.

  10. http://www.jihadwatch.org/